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New Post 4/4/2008 3:06 PM
  Nancy Chase
207 posts
4th Level Poster




Military 

My oldest brother joined the Navy when he was a sophomore in college, mainly because he had partied away his entire freshman year and fall semester of soph. year.  Typical of many college freshmen, even today - although nowadays there are stopgaps put in place to help identify students at risk, moreso than back in those days. .He joined the Navy because he thought he'd be drafted & sent to Vietnam if he flunked out of school.  He also joined the Navy because my father was a naval submarine veteran of WWII, and he thought it would please him.

Where does this misguided sense of having to please their fathers come from?  I mean, there's "pleasing" and then there's making a life changing decision that  you haven't really thought through, and are too young to know the consequences that may result from it.  Mostly occurs with boys - Its unusual I think, for a girl to feel that way.  And I say "misguided" because in many ways it is.  The Navy was perhaps the biggest mistake my brother ever made - it altered his life and changed his direction immeasureably - in ways too complex to mention here - when all he really needed back then was a little counseling - he could've gotten help in school and with a little more discipline he would've gotten through to graduation.

I don't doubt the military life is the right choice for some, you seem to have gotten satisfaction out of it, but I'm steering my sons (and my daughters) far, far away from it. 

 
New Post 4/4/2008 4:01 PM
  catnapping
16 posts
theoddneighbor.blogspot.com/
No Ranking


Re: Military 
Modified By catnapping  on 4/4/2008 4:05:33 PM)

I think it's natural for children to emulate their elders. And it really wasn't that long ago that the norm was for children to follow in their parents' footsteps. (this was especially limiting for females, because so many cultures left on the planet only allowed females to be animated masturbation appliances, whelping machines, and lactating units.)

Dad was cobbler - his sons became cobblers. Or at the very least, the eldest did. Children learned their parents' trade - their parents' skills to survive.

Once upon a time, those skills included hunting mammoth...learning where the best berries and medicinal plants were. Nowadays, it's learning how to keep from getting knifed on the way home from work. When I was growing up, most small businesses included "& sons" in their name.

It would never have occured to any of my brothers to not join the military. Dad was not only in the military during the whole of their childhoods (and mine), we mostly lived on military posts. Our whole world was military. Good lord, until I was ten, all the adult males in my world were addressed, 'sergeant.' They all wore fatigues and flight suits when they weren't in dress uniforms. They were all adorned in stripes and ribbons...it's all i knew...all my brothers knew.

It's an entire subculture.

I hope you do keep your kids away from it. It's a dysfunctional culture. It's propped up on an absolute totalitarian system. authoritarianism to the extreme. do as i say WHEN i say it. and NEVER EVER question what i say. EVER.

My children did not join the military. It stopped with my generation. Thank god.

editing here:

yes. i did derive satisfaction. i did quite well for the time i was in. i was a community health nurse, and on the FACMT team. (I helped investigate child abuse cases.) I loved my job. and quite frankly, i loved wearing the uniform. but then, i was socialized to, ey? upbringing...it's hard to escape all that hard-wiring.

 

 
New Post 4/4/2008 4:55 PM
  Nancy Chase
207 posts
4th Level Poster




Re: Military 

you know cat, - this reply of yours is even better than the original that I responded to.   Lots more insight here (although the original was good too)

 
New Post 4/4/2008 7:08 PM
  Keifus
388 posts
3rd Level Poster




Re: Military 

By the way, the tension between being a female and following in your parents footsteps really showed up in teh piece.  I was going to make a comment, but here you are acknowledging it.  Interesting stuff.  Glad times have changed, but I'd be surprised if they have all that much in the military.

Topazz, your story about your brother joining the Navy to avoid the draft reminded me of my father-in-law.  It didn't work out so well for him either.  Probably not my story to tell, though.

K

 
New Post 4/5/2008 5:16 AM
  catnapping
16 posts
theoddneighbor.blogspot.com/
No Ranking


Re: Military 
Modified By catnapping  on 4/5/2008 5:17:57 AM)

I'm thinkin' they probably haven't changed one damned bit.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-harman31mar31,0,5399612.story

I'm glad you liked my narrative. thank you.

 
New Post 4/8/2008 9:52 AM
  rundeep
324 posts
3rd Level Poster


I very much enjoyed that Cat. 

Did I miss it, or did you not mention a Mom at all? Me, I was born watching TV involving body bags. My brother's number came up, but he made sure he had physical ailments to keep him out.  In a way, it's a shame -- he's a nutcase, and for all its ills, the structure of the military could have, maybe, given him some needed stability.

 
New Post 4/16/2008 6:50 PM
  catnapping
16 posts
theoddneighbor.blogspot.com/
No Ranking


Re: I very much enjoyed that Cat. 

my mom was pretty much irrelevant to this particular narrative...this was between me and my dad. i was looking at a little piece of our relationship.

it's hard to say what the military might have done for or to your brother. it may well have made him worse, depending on how old he was went he'd have gone in.

there's some heavy-duty indoctrination and resocialization that goes on...it starts in basic training, but truly...it doesn't end there. they own you. they feed you; they clothe you; they shelter...(heh...think stockholm's syndrome...it works in any dysfunctional relationship...it's what keeps women tied to the men who eventually beat them to death.)

i've read men on the fray who post word for word...crap they learned in the military...shit they were spoon-fed by their NCOs...I heard the same shit, day after day. Thankfully, I knew better than to swallow. But I wasn't 17. And I wasn't male. (yep. i said that....drill sergeants will be the first to admit...women are harder to break than men/ harder to RE-socialize). we aren't as eager to belong to the "pack" as the guys are...maybe cuz we aren't trained early enough on to think that way...

obviously we're social...and we want to belong to the clan...but for some reason, we think and behave more independently in the military than do the guys. when they say 'jump' we're always second guessing.

 
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